Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: l...@put.com (Louis Epstein)
Date: 1999/05/18
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
Guy Stair Sainty (G...@newsguy.com) wrote:
: In the Diary of yesterday's London Times, the following item appeared: : : "THE ballroom of Claridge's swelled with Prince Sixte Henri de Bourbon Parma and : other Euro-exotics celebrating the relaunch of Almanach de Gotha - the first : time the stud book of continental grandees has been published since Jerry : overran the East. : : "Some months on I learn that its editor, Charlotte Pike, a former toff-tester at : Burke's Peerage, is less than chuffed with its publisher, John Kennedy. She is : taking legal action in a copyright dispute which could rock the almanac. : : "Kennedy (formely Gvozdenovic) is intriguing. He was the private secretary to : Prince Michael of Kent, with whom he parted on bad terms. : : "He is also a one-time Tory hopeful, who suggested that he was engaged to a : Balkan princess. The princess seemed rather surprised by his bold announcement." : : There is more to this story that will no doubt be revealed both about : this suit and Mr Kennedy (the subject of many newspaper articles in the : British press concerning his activities with a Libyan Prince, his arrest, : his involvement with a Yugoslav businessman and a suit for defamation : against the Sunday Times that Kennedy never pursued, etc). : : Kennedy, born Gvozdenovic (of Montenegrin Serbian ancestry) was allegedly, : according to some newspaper reports, involved with the charming leadership : of the Republic Srbska - the unrecognized rump led by an indicted war : criminal - and even at one time with Milosevic, although Mr Kennedy has denied : this. : : Ms Pike's (the Plaintiff) suit alleges that “upon the formation of the company : equity should be issued and divided as a percentage of 51% to the Plaintiff and : 25% to the Defendant, 24% to remain unissued with the purpose that it may be : used to attract future equity investment. The effect of this provision was that : the Plaintiff was entitled to 67.1% of all shares actually issued….. : : “On or about 16 Sep 1997 the Defendant became the sole beneficial owner of the : equity capital of the company and was appointed the sole director of the : company. At no time did he arrange the issue or allotment of any shares to the : Plaintiff. Seems like these arrangements were bungled. There being no shares issued to the Perthes family,I assume the company : 9. “On or about 16 March 1998 the company published an edition of the work being So is she or is she not responsible for the questionable Romanov You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: Guy Stair Sainty <G...@newsguy.com>
Date: 1999/05/18
Subject: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
In the Diary of yesterday's London Times, the following item appeared:
"THE ballroom of Claridge's swelled with Prince Sixte Henri de Bourbon Parma and "Some months on I learn that its editor, Charlotte Pike, a former toff-tester at "Kennedy (formely Gvozdenovic) is intriguing. He was the private secretary to "He is also a one-time Tory hopeful, who suggested that he was engaged to a There is more to this story that will no doubt be revealed both about Kennedy, born Gvozdenovic (of Montenegrin Serbian ancestry) was allegedly, Ms Pike's (the Plaintiff) suit alleges that “upon the formation of the company “On or about 16 Sep 1997 the Defendant became the sole beneficial owner of the “On or about 16 Sep 1997 the Plaintiff was appointed company secretary of the 7. “At no time did the Defendant inform the Plaintiff that, notwithstanding the 8. “Although the Plaintiff was appointed company secretary, and notwithstanding 9. “On or about 16 March 1998 the company published an edition of the work being 10. “ At no time has the Plaintiff received any benefit from the publication by 11. “The Plaintiff avers that had the agreement been properly implemented by the 12. “ …… By virtue of the said failures the Defendant has benefited at the 13. “By reason of the foregoing, the Defendant (a) is liable, by way of specific performance, to transfer shares amounting to 14. “ The Defendant is in the alternative entitled to damages for breach of 15. “ the Plaintiff further claims to be entitled to general damages for her These allegations will no doubt be resolved in the eventual court action. StairSai...@msn.com You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: astya...@my-dejanews.com
Date: 1999/05/19
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
In article <7hrlv0$2...@drn.newsguy.com>,
Guy Stair Sainty <G...@newsguy.com> wrote: I regret to say that I had not yet discovered atr when you people were talking about the '98 edition. What is the overall feeling in atr towards John Kennedy, Charlotte Pike, and the resuscitated de Gotha? --- J.M.K. --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: sascha5...@my-dejanews.com
Date: 1999/05/20
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
In article <7hvbrb$n4...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
astya...@my-dejanews.com wrote: following item appeared: > In article <7hrlv0$2...@drn.newsguy.com>, > Guy Stair Sainty <G...@newsguy.com> wrote: > > In the Diary of yesterday's London Times, the > > "THE ballroom of Claridge's swelled with > > other Euro-exotics celebrating the relaunch of Almanach de Gotha - the first > > time the stud book of continental grandees has been published since Jerry > > overran the East. Charlotte Pike, a former toff-tester at > > "Some months on I learn that its editor, > > Burke's Peerage, is less than chuffed with its publisher, John Kennedy. She is > > taking legal action in a copyright dispute which could rock the almanac. > > "Kennedy (formely Gvozdenovic) is intriguing. > > Prince Michael of Kent, with whom he parted on suggested that he was engaged to a bad terms. > > "He is also a one-time Tory hopeful, who > > Balkan princess. The princess seemed rather surprised by his bold announcement." > > There is more to this story that will no doubt > > this suit and Mr Kennedy (the subject of many newspaper articles in the > > British press concerning his activities with a Libyan Prince, his arrest, > > his involvement with a Yugoslav businessman and a suit for defamation > > against the Sunday Times that Kennedy never Serbian ancestry) was allegedly, pursued, etc). > > Kennedy, born Gvozdenovic (of Montenegrin > > according to some newspaper reports, involved with the charming leadership > > of the Republic Srbska - the unrecognized rump led by an indicted war > > criminal - and even at one time with Milosevic, although Mr Kennedy has denied > > this. “upon the formation of the company > > Ms Pike's (the Plaintiff) suit alleges that > > equity should be issued and divided as a percentage of 51% to the Plaintiff and > > 25% to the Defendant, 24% to remain unissued with the purpose that it may be > > used to attract future equity investment. The effect of this provision was that > > the Plaintiff was entitled to 67.1% of all shares actually issued….. > I regret to say that I had not yet discovered atr when you people were > talking about the '98 edition. What is the overall feeling in atr towards > John Kennedy, Charlotte Pike, and the resuscitated de Gotha? > --- J.M.K. > --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- or twists nothing that isn't already known. Most of this also has nothing to do with the Almanach de Gotha. As editor/publisher, Mr Kennedy, has the support of many of the heads of European dynasties in this project (and two crowned kings)--all one has to do is look at the Patronage Committe in the 1999 edition. The new edition has also received raves in aristocratic circles in Europe and is a fine improvement on the "Pike" edition. Ms Pike should perhaps better not claim anything against anyone considering the details that have emerged on her "careers" before Gotha, and her continued unprofessional and incorrect manner during and after her "work" with the Gotha. She is unimportant to the publication and has nothing to do with the new edition. As to Mr Sainty, who has used the title of Almanach de Gotha (the title belongs to the original publishers--Perthes in Germany--who are very satisfied with the new Gotha) without right as well as information from the 1998 Gotha (including some of the errors!) on his websites, there is really nothing to be said--he seems to say it all himself. It is obvious why Mr Sainty is so interested in promoting this worthless information. Certainly, the Houses listed in the Almanach de Gotha are familiar with the attitudes of the press and care nothing about this absurd subversion of Mr Kennedy, a trusted editor of an important work. RD --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: l...@put.com (Louis Epstein)
Date: 1999/05/20
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
: In article <7hvbrb$n4...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
: astya...@my-dejanews.com wrote: : > In article <7hrlv0$2...@drn.newsguy.com>, : > Guy Stair Sainty <G...@newsguy.com> wrote: : > > In the Diary of yesterday's London Times, the : following item appeared: : > > : > > "THE ballroom of Claridge's swelled with : Prince Sixte Henri de Bourbon Parma and : > > other Euro-exotics celebrating the relaunch of : Almanach de Gotha - the first : > > time the stud book of continental grandees has : been published since Jerry : > > overran the East. : > > : > > "Some months on I learn that its editor, : Charlotte Pike, a former toff-tester at : > > Burke's Peerage, is less than chuffed with its : publisher, John Kennedy. She is : > > taking legal action in a copyright dispute : which could rock the almanac. : > > : > > "Kennedy (formely Gvozdenovic) is intriguing. : He was the private secretary to : > > Prince Michael of Kent, with whom he parted on : bad terms. : > > : > > "He is also a one-time Tory hopeful, who : suggested that he was engaged to a : > > Balkan princess. The princess seemed rather : surprised by his bold announcement." : > > : > > There is more to this story that will no doubt : be revealed both about : > > this suit and Mr Kennedy (the subject of many : newspaper articles in the : > > British press concerning his activities with a : Libyan Prince, his arrest, : > > his involvement with a Yugoslav businessman : and a suit for defamation : > > against the Sunday Times that Kennedy never : pursued, etc). : > > : > > Kennedy, born Gvozdenovic (of Montenegrin : Serbian ancestry) was allegedly, : > > according to some newspaper reports, involved : with the charming leadership : > > of the Republic Srbska - the unrecognized rump : led by an indicted war : > > criminal - and even at one time with : Milosevic, although Mr Kennedy has denied : > > this. : > > : > > Ms Pike's (the Plaintiff) suit alleges that : “upon the formation of the company : > > equity should be issued and divided as a : percentage of 51% to the Plaintiff and : > > 25% to the Defendant, 24% to remain unissued : with the purpose that it may be : > > used to attract future equity investment. The : effect of this provision was that : > > the Plaintiff was entitled to 67.1% of all : shares actually issued….. : > I regret to say that I had not yet discovered : atr when you people were : > talking about the '98 edition. What is : the overall feeling in atr towards : > John Kennedy, Charlotte Pike, and the : resuscitated de Gotha? : > : > --- J.M.K. : > : : This is, of course, a sensationalism that reveals : or twists nothing that isn't already known. Most : of this also has nothing to do with the Almanach : de Gotha. As editor/publisher, Mr Kennedy, has : the support of many of the heads of European : dynasties in this project (and two crowned : kings)--all one has to do is look at the Patronage : Committe in the 1999 edition. Yes,where he credits Prince Nicholas Romanovsky-Sheremeteff : The new edition has Well,the volume was promoted with leaflets(I have one) that : As to Mr Sainty, who has used the title of Could you perhaps declare any affiliation of your own? You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: sascha5...@my-dejanews.com
Date: 1999/05/21
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
In article <FC0JEr....@news2.new-york.net>,
l...@put.com (Louis Epstein) wrote: You obviously have an outdated early leaflet (I have it too)--you must have the 1998 sales blurb where Pike promoted herself and claimed the edition had been checked by Williamson (he denies this). Kennedy was the publisher and so remained in the background as is usual. Are you perhaps not aware that there is a 1999 edition--that is the Patronage Committee I refer to. The 1999 leaflet--prepared for the Kennedy Gotha also does not boast about Kennedy--he just got on as editor and did the job. He even removed his own name from the cover of the new book. As to my affiliation--I am a Professor of European Studies, a literary and film critic and a genealogist who focuses on Central European nobility. I celebrated the return of the Gotha when I first heard about it and considered the first edition a good try, considering the amount of work that was needed to cover the last half-century of developments. I also learned of the problems and Ms Pike etc. and mourned the silly sabotage of what might have been a real coup. I am all the more pleased that the new Gotha has continued and that edition under Kennedy alone is so impressive (traditional 1930s typeset and buff-tone papers; corrections of the earlier errors; addition of Holy See information and Ottoman Empire lines) and is now supported by even more royal houses (3 Habsburg Archdukes, etc.). Perhaps those of us interested in the material it offers can now use it as a revitalized and important source. Given the problems of the world, I find the scandal-sheet attitude toward the publication of A BOOK rather pointless, don't you? --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: Dag T. Hoelseth <dag...@my-dejanews.com>
Date: 1999/05/21
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
In article <7i2anu$rh...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
It would perhaps be on time that you revealed your name? Scandal-sheet attitude or not, this is a forum for discussions on royalty and royalty-related issues. There are many genealogists and historians here who are interested in genealogical works and find it useful to discuss among others Almanach de Gotha. Although I am pleased that it has returned, there still are so many mistakes which need to be commented on. The history of AdeG is interesting in itself, so certainly thee is a point in discussing a possible court case. Dag T. Hoelseth -- --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: Steven_Laval...@Brown.edu
Date: 1999/05/21
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
sascha5...@my-dejanews.com wrote: The Gotha is certainly prettier this year, and several glaring > I am all the more pleased > that the new Gotha has continued and that edition under Kennedy alone is > so impressive (traditional 1930s typeset and buff-tone papers; > corrections of the earlier errors; addition of Holy See information and > Ottoman Empire lines) and is now supported by even more royal houses (3 > Habsburg Archdukes, etc.). Perhaps those of us interested in the > material it offers can now use it as a revitalized and important source. errors were corrected. However, as a genealogical reference book, it continues to be laden with errors, omissions and inconsistencies. We need to be honest and open here about its flaws here, as well In both 1998 and 1999 editions: Wrong year of death for Alexandra of Anhalt. On the other hand, I also note these 1999 improvements in the same pages: Edda of Anhalt's husband's place and date of birth Don't misunderstand. I am very happy to have a copy of the Gotha, > the new Gotha [snip] is now supported by even more royal houses Well, those Archdukes need to pay more than chi-chi lip-service, > (3 Habsburg Archdukes, etc.). and get busy correcting and adding to the article on their family!! ;-) Steven Lavallee You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: canne...@my-dejanews.com
Date: 1999/05/21
Subject: Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
>>Don't misunderstand. I am very happy to have a copy of the Gotha,
and I heartily applaud the effort of those who obviously worked hard on it, and are trying to improve it. However, the lovely paper and the exquisite typeface does not "cut it" with those who are buying the book primarily as a reference tool. The new Gotha is certainly "a source of information," but unless some significant work is undertaken by somebody, it is premature and somewhat misleading at this time to acclaim the Gotha "a revitalized and important source."<< This is a very good posting and makes a serious point. The Gotha was The reason the Gotha would never have come back if we waited for the Members of this forum seem to be being dragged into a commercial take Your point about families pulling their fingers out is a good one - it --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: alt.talk.royalty
From: "Noel S. McFerran" <mcfer...@internetcorp.net>
Date: 1999/05/22
Subject: AdeG v. GHdA, was Re: Almanach de Gotha and Mr John Kennedy
Just why all this fuss over the production of the Almanach de Gotha?
Didn't we already have a reasonably good equivalent in the Genealogisches Handbuch des Adels? I'm not suggesting that the GHdA is perfect (you can't please everyone in Brazil and the Two Sicilies), but it seemed to me that it had filled the place of the former Almanach de Gotha rather well. Many libraries and individuals who had not purchased the Genealogisches I'm just asking. Noel S. McFerran You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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